Wis. jury: Father guilty in prayer death case


(golfpapabravo06) #1

Sadly this girl died of diabetes because her father neglected to get her proper treatment.

WAUSAU, Wis. – A central Wisconsin man accused of killing his 11-year-old daughter by praying instead of seeking medical care was found guilty Saturday of second-degree reckless homicide.

Dale Neumann, 47, was convicted in the March 23, 2008, death of his daughter, Madeline, from undiagnosed diabetes. Prosecutors contended he should have rushed the girl to a hospital because she couldn't walk, talk, eat or drink. Instead, Madeline died on the floor of the family's rural Weston home as people surrounded her and prayed. Someone called 911 when she stopped breathing.  

The article continues further if you would like to keep reading.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090802/ap_on_re_us/us_prayer_death;_ylt=Avonc2Qx584v1PAg9X5utSVvzwcF;_ylu=X3oDMTJrNmNwMDQzBGFzc2V0A2FwLzIwMDkwODAyL3VzX3ByYXllcl9kZWF0aARwb3MDMQRzZWMDeW5fYXJ0aWNsZV9zdW1tYXJ5X2xpc3QEc2xrA3dpc2p1cnlmYXRoZQ--

 


(system) #2

and yet more proof why i stay a mile away from religion..because of physcos like this that take their faith/beliefs too far.


(KC_Casey) #3

[quote user="Batts"]

and yet more proof why i stay a mile away from religion..because of physcos like this that take their faith/beliefs too far.

[/quote]

 

ya know i see what batts was saying in the last blog i posted. byt still wow.


(TinaM) #4

That was religion. Which has nothing to do with God. God would not have wanted that.


(Eric_Carpenter) #5

If the practice of religion, which is typically done in the name of a deity, caused harm that said deity would not want, why didn't "it" do something about the death?  Either here god is impotent and cannot intervene, is cruel and did not want to intervene, or simply does not exist.


(BrianPQuinn) #6

This is sad to hear such comments about God in this manner. Mind you I am not defending this what happened in any such way. What happened with this child is a tragic occurrence that should not have happened. Due however to misguided beliefs or the aversion to medicine based upon faith this child died. It is not right, it is not fair that this happened. However, the one who has to live with the mistake is not us, but the father. We are all given free choice to make our own decisions. God did not force this father to not take his daughter to the hospital for treatment. God, did not force this man to believe such as he did. That decision came solely from the father and his own beliefs and interpretation of whatever faith he was raised with.

God is not cruel, nor is he evil. The evil we see in the world comes from the hearts of men. Sin came into the world because of man. We are given the freedom to choose what is right and wrong and yet at some point in our lives we all will make a bad choice. This is the nature of being human. Hopefully, our choices will not result in the death of anyone or anything, but we never know. If God were to make our own decisions for us, if God were to force us to do something we did not want to do, we would not have the freedom we were granted when we came into existence. Instead of blaming God in this instance one should at some level feel sympathy for the father for what he is experiencing and will have to live with for the rest of his life. Feel sympathy for the family for losing their child. But know that at least in my belief while the girl may have suffered, right now she is a place where she is being taken care of better than how she could have been treated here.


(Eric_Carpenter) #7

I do feel sorry for the fact that this happened, I do feel sympathy for this family, and for the innocent girl this happened to.  This does not change the fact that free will is a creation of man, a poor defense for the question "why does god let bad things happen to good people?", nor does it change the fact that an almighty individual choosing to remain silent while innocents suffer would be cruel (if existant).


(Sarah_0776) #8

[quote user="Brian"]

This is sad to hear such comments about God in this manner. Mind you I am not defending this what happened in any such way. What happened with this child is a tragic occurrence that should not have happened. Due however to misguided beliefs or the aversion to medicine based upon faith this child died. It is not right, it is not fair that this happened. However, the one who has to live with the mistake is not us, but the father. We are all given free choice to make our own decisions. God did not force this father to not take his daughter to the hospital for treatment. God, did not force this man to believe such as he did. That decision came solely from the father and his own beliefs and interpretation of whatever faith he was raised with.

God is not cruel, nor is he evil. The evil we see in the world comes from the hearts of men. Sin came into the world because of man. We are given the freedom to choose what is right and wrong and yet at some point in our lives we all will make a bad choice. This is the nature of being human. Hopefully, our choices will not result in the death of anyone or anything, but we never know. If God were to make our own decisions for us, if God were to force us to do something we did not want to do, we would not have the freedom we were granted when we came into existence. Instead of blaming God in this instance one should at some level feel sympathy for the father for what he is experiencing and will have to live with for the rest of his life. Feel sympathy for the family for losing their child. But know that at least in my belief while the girl may have suffered, right now she is a place where she is being taken care of better than how she could have been treated here.

[/quote]

Well said, Brian. I couldn't have voiced those words better.


(golfpapabravo06) #9

wow i was just pointing out how SOME people are ignorant, that doesn't mean everyone involved with religion is ignorant.  Can't we just feel bad for the girl who lost her life without bashing religion? :P


(amyl1027) #10

     It's horrible that this little girl had to die when she/those involved in her care were given the necessary tools to treat her medical condition.  How can a person make the determination about when treatment is allowed and when it isn't when the supplies are available?  A situation like this should have never happened.  What were all those so called social workers doing in this case?  Obviously, not their jobs.


(CHLjoe) #11

[quote user="amyl1027"]

     It's horrible that this little girl had to die when she/those involved in her care were given the necessary tools to treat her medical condition.  How can a person make the determination about when treatment is allowed and when it isn't when the supplies are available?  A situation like this should have never happened.  What were all those so called social workers doing in this case?  Obviously, not their jobs.

[/quote]

From what I read in the article, none of this was present and only onlookers and her parents.  The father refused to take her to a doctor quoting:

"If I go to the doctor, I am putting the doctor before God," Neumann testified. "I am not believing what he said he would do."

The father chose to remain ignorant and watched his daughter die.  I certainly have no sympathy for him or his wife.  It was their decision to not treat their daughter which led to her death.


(amyl1027) #12

     Previously when this case first became an issue there was a mention of social worker involvement.  From what I've seen so many social workers are fearful of the position in which they are placed.  Someone needs to stand up for these children when they aren't given a chance to stand up for themselves.  The first people respnsible are, indeed, the parents.  I'd love to see what the father would do if he had to treat himself.  He probably wouldn't feel the same anymore.


(Brittany) #13

Omg! That's so sad! That makes me want to cry. Maybe her dad will get what he deserves. Maybe when the people find out what he did maybe they will beat him up or something. Trust me he will get what is coming to him. In the end he will regret everything that happened.


(Eric_Carpenter) #14

amyl1027, could you elaborate on the social worker issue?  I have heard that the system is overburdened and underfunded, but this is the first I have heard about fear.


(amyl1027) #15

     There is so much in the way of political pressure involved in the social work system.  Everybody wants to look good, but too few care about the welfare of those actually suffering.  Those who really want to make a differrence are usually so low on the totem pole that they get overridden and overruled.  Maybe it's just in my state, but it seems that only the issues that can be handled more easily get addressed.   Too many things just get swept under the carpet.  If everyone in the social work setting could get issues addressed on an as needed basis, it would run so much more effectively.  Not everyone is at fault;  it's just like almost every other system.